Friday, October 12, 2012

[Maxwell Smart]Missed by that much![/Maxwell Smart]

Eddie Johnson to the rescue in a game that USMNT could have actually lost. Believe it or not, but he is now tied for second with Brian McBride on 10 career World Cup qualifying goals.







- Greg Seltzer

69 comments:

david said...

The last half hour of that game, the American Outlaws bar in NYC was filled with fans lamenting, "How could we be playing this bad? Against THIS team?" Might as well have been a World Cup knockout game with how we all reacted to this goal. EJ!

dikranovich said...

reality #1 usa needs fabian johnson at left back, because he makes the whole defense better

reality #2 jozy altidore is a gifted player, but im positive that he could not have scored either of the goals that usa scored tonight. maybe the second one, but doubtful. highly.

now im going to go root for mexico, ahh, i mean jamaica.

Greg Seltzer said...

Anyone else wanna handle these two "points"? It's light work.

dikranovich said...

reality #3 coach klinsmann is coaching for his usmnt coaching life on tuesday night. these things that dont kill you, make you stronger.

Will said...

I just assumed he was making more stupid comments to get a rise out of you. Surely no one is that clueless, are they?

The Streetsweeper said...

Dear D'Kran,

Regarding point #2 you might find this useful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRCICbMQzeY

as well as this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRCICbMQzeY

You will find, therein 5 more examples of goals with the head, as well as plenty of examples of goals with the feet in which Jozy distances himself from his defender with a multi-directional run in the box.

My question is, if Jozy starts for Gomez, given his current club form (vs Gomez's current club form) does Jozy finish one of those two opportunities Gomez had and help put the game away before the 90th?

dikranovich said...

sweeper, good point, herc had bad touches twice when he got behind defenders.

reality #4 deuce is still more suited for the #9 role, not the 10. he drops back to deep to retrieve the ball and he should be up top pouncing on balls. deuce is trying to exert to much control on the national team, and that is not his style.

dikranovich said...

addendum to reality #4 deuce can play left mid, he was voted to the all epl team as a left mid. give him the 11 jersey. 2+10+11=23

dikranovich said...

just a little thing, but it is hex-ag-o-nal, not hex-a-gon-al

paully said...

hehe.... EJ scored quite some goals. :)

BTM said...

We need Fabian Johnson on the field. And we need Carlos Bocanegra not to be playing left back. I think we can all agree on that much.

The Streetsweeper said...

D'novich,

I have to agree with your point #4 regarding Dempsey at left mid (Dark Ages numerology aside)

I feel like Klinsmann's overwhelming desire to be the smartest guy in the room is, among many other things, compelling him to try to magically unlock some sort of unrealized Dempsey-USMNT-potential. Such a goal is, in my opinion, rather silly. Putting Dempsey on the outside gets him in more one-on-one situations to either get loose or win set pieces. It also affords him the option to drift/dart into the middle when we have possession centrally or on the right (or possession in the person of Fabian Johnson overlapping on the left).

If you play a 4-4-2 with whoever you want up top (let's say, just for fun, Jozy and Wondo) and then you play Dempsey-Bradley-Williams-Donovan that is a pretty stoat front six, stronger after Bradley and Williams get used to each other without Jones getting in the way. And don't give me this crap about not enough defense in the middle of the park. We damn near got to the semis in 2002 with a midfield, at it's most defensive, of Lewis-O'Brien-Mastroeni-Renya. Not exactly the Steel Curtain.

Zach said...

Mc-Steemy,

So true! Minus the part about Wondolowski.

I would argue that unless we have Shea in top form, Dempsey is our most effective "LW". Especially with Fabian making runs up the wing from LB, giving Dempsey the freedom to pinch inside in final third. Deuce needs to pick up the ball while moving towards goal, not this check back with back to goal to receive passes 50 yards out.

The pitch was terrible last night. Asking a team of professionals to play on that is like asking them to suddenly compete in beach soccer. Every ball would slow up, then speed up, then hop. Impossible to prepare for unless you practice on it. Also laughable how much grass was outside the touch lines. That could have been an 80yd wide field easily. Sneaky Benna's!

AWF08 said...

First, talking lineups when the full team is either not in camp or injured is kind of a silly game. That was not the lineup that we'd see if everyone was in and available. So, arguing make shift lineups is a fools errand.
2nd, @StreetSweeper--I like your points and tend to agree. Only contention I have is that the '02 midfield was more naturally creative and better in possession, as a whole, than the lineup you propose. Especially for creativity, I would argue for a 4-5-1 or 4-3-3 with a more dedicated creative source in the middle of the park.
Now, if you're saying that MB and DW will get much better in possession (when compared to O'Brian and Reyna) LD and Deuce will float and be the creators and Johnson and Dolo (doubt it at 35/36) will play a Maicon type of outside back--then I would probably agree. But, thats asking a lot of players to improve and/or do something we really haven't see previously.
Wouldn't it be easier to have something like:
Dempsey---Jozy--LD
--Feilhaber/Adu/SK--
--Bradley--------------
----------Williams-----
FJ--CB--GC--Lichaj/Dolo
------Howard-----
(I know Greg, but until we actually see someone even considered at LB--I have FJ there. And, Even when we do, I'm not sure where to put him unless its something like he moves to Dempsey's spot and Deuce takes over the creative spot in the middle.)

UnitedDemon said...

Can we talk about the fact that we were all praying for a second EJ goal?

That's insanity. If he hadn't scored two goals AT LEFT MID, we would be screwed.

Neither Herc nor Dempsey did anything in this game. Is JK not going to call them up again, or are we finally going to admit that the lineup doesn't allow for acceptable service to the forward line?

The Streetsweeper said...

If I am not mistaken, here is the math if we had lost, prior to the Guatemala/Jamaica game

Guatemala 7 points +2 GD
USA 7 points +1 GD
Jamaica 7 points +1 GD

----

So, let's say Guatemala beats Jamaica by one goal. Not an impossible scenario by any stretch (it just happened).

That would mean the standings would look like this:

Guatemala 10 points at +3
USA 7 points at +1
Jamaica 7 points at 0

---------

Now, it's back against the wall time! So we go out there and play our hearts out and beat Guatemala in KC, but we hit the woodwork a few times and the little fish sneaks one and we only win by 1. Now let's also say that A&B are so worn out from their high of beating us that they kind of phone it in against Jamaica at the Office. And Jamaica wins by three. Ladies and gentlemen, we don't make the Hex. Even if Jamaica only wins by two there's a pretty good chance it comes down to drawing straws to advance.

----

So here is my concern. In the first half A&B were defending corners with 8 field players. We were attacking with 7. Fine. But then, in the second half, specifically with the game tied and 5 minutes to play, A&B is defending corners with only 7... But we keep sending 7. And from that corner A&B launches a counter attack that could have (should have) resulted in a goal. Blackstock was totally unmarked at Howard's far post. So. It seems to me that ours was a team that had not prepared for or thought through the potential of such a scenario (tied late in the game). It certainly seems to me that a throw caution to the wind, attack-with-all-possible-numbers mentality should NOT have been the approach to close out this game. Not at all. Because a tie would have kept us in the driver's seat, points wise, going into the final game. What bothers me about this is it speaks to Klinsmann's overall approach to coaching, that it is less about tactics, or player selection or even skillsets, and more about "attitude" "belief" and "suffering". It is somehow less about preparing your team tactically and more about preparing them mentally. Hey jerkoff! You know how we've gotten by the last 20 years? Our mentality! Ask Jay DeMerit about it, that is, if you ever call him in. Dempsey, Mathis, Ramos, McBride, hell, Frankie Hejduk were beating teams with their mentality long before you started spreading your pop psychology around US Soccer like so much manure. Yes, sometimes coaching is about mental preparation... Other times it's just preparation!!! X's and O's. If this, than that. If this happens, we do this. Chicarito has a crap day, the Italians forget how offsides works, Clark scores in the 90th minute. Take those three results away and the only teams he has beaten this year are Scotland, Panama (barely), Jamaica at home and a nation smaller than Andorra.

Well I shouldn't complain. At least he was able to succeed where Bradley failed. It's great to have Chandler as a mainstay of the national team.

dikranovich said...

fantasy is great, but in reality, usa have 10 pts, and one more point guarantees usa advancement.

dikranovich said...

and also, in reality, eddie johnson was playing striker when he scored his second goal. that is reality!!!

Greg Seltzer said...

Simply and undeniably untrue. What is wrong with you?

dikranovich said...

greg, care to put your money where your mouth is?

dikranovich said...

what the heck is so hard with believing ej moved up top when gomez came off? i mean, jesus. lord have mercy.

Greg Seltzer said...

As if you'd ever pay up... no thanks.

You already tried to claim that Deuce moved wide left, which a simple check to last night's Chalkboard will demonstrate is wild BS pulled out of thin air. And if no one was wide left, then Bocanegra, who struggled all night, would have had the entire left side to himself. Ludicrous.

Not to mention that the second goal was scored from a RESTART in the A&B end.

Why do you do this? Seriously.

Greg Seltzer said...

Gordon replaced Gomez up top. Big fat duh.

dikranovich said...

no greg, i claimed that junior moved left, not deuce.

Greg Seltzer said...

You're right, my bad. However... that's an even more ridiculous claim.

http://www.mlssoccer.com/matchcenter/2012-10-12-atg-v-usa/chalkboard

dikranovich said...

greg, ill save you a couple bucks. go read the post match quote sheet on ussoccer.com, then come back and tell me eddie johnson was playing left mid when he scored his second goal. please!!!!

greg, im starting to get the idea that you did not actually see the game.

Greg Seltzer said...

Ah yes... Mr. Truthful Quotes, himself. Gimme a break.

Find me a left-sider for that supposed diamond. I dare you. I triple-quadruple brontosaurus dare you. You can't. Period.

Greg Seltzer said...

I love this part: "... and switch Clint back to a No. 10... "


Erm, that's where he was all night, regardless of what anyone wants to call his position in that bizarre formation.

brian said...

EJ post game interview he said that he moved up top. Uh oh this should be good....

Greg Seltzer said...

Moved up top or was told to press forward? The Chalkboard does not lie, folks. Find me a left-sider for this diamond claimed in the very same supposedly infallible quote. Until then, there is no debate to be had.

Sorry, my brain does not shut off when someone speaks. I have eyes. I have Chalkboard. There was no diamond and EJ was working left midfield just before the goal sequence. Not sure what else to say.

Greg Seltzer said...

Or if you'd prefer we can go through all the Klinsmann quotes from the last 14 months that do not bear out - like how the coach was pleased Altidore was working so hard in May/June camp. :/

brian said...

"moved up top" watch the interview. It comes out of his own mouth

Greg Seltzer said...

Wonderful... find us a left side to the diamond then. Should be child's play, right?

Look, guys, I'm so sorry I don't just accept everything I hear without thought. The comments do not add up, plain and simple. It is not the first time.

brian said...

I bellive EJ in that he was playing "up top" along side Gordon. I mean I thinks he knew what position he was playing. I also don't think u watched the game. He was the closest to the ab goal when that ball was crossed. Pretty much in the middle of the field. Stop trying to find this left diamond and accept that EJ was up top. Because EJ said so!

Greg Seltzer said...

And just to be clear, I could not care less if I was wrong. Would not be the first time, wouldn't be the last. If a story does not add up, I'm not gonna buy it. That's me.

Greg Seltzer said...

Yes! Stop trying to find the entire basis of the claim we're debating!

Hilarious. As is the reality that the second goal was scored from a RESTART ON THE RIGHT near time, so I'd love to have you tell me where you'd expect EJ to be.

Greg Seltzer said...

I really can't care, this is yet another meaningless argument pushed by dikranovich, who does little else here besides pushing meaningless arguments, ignoring any and all rebuttals, slurring anyone who doesn't anoint him the Pope while he declares himself the infallible winner. Go crazy with that if you must.

brian said...

I not part of you and dik argument about the left player I'm just stating that EJ was playin up top. I wouldn't expect a lw to be in front of Dempsey on that play and. More centrally. I'm done. Sorry I believe EJ own words more so than your claims/chalkboards or whatever.

Greg Seltzer said...

Dude... he does not say when the "tactical switch" occurred, while dikranovich is claiming that it happened the second Gordon came on for Gomez, with Bradley moving wide left (LMAO). For all we know, this "switch" occurred seconds before the goal.

You think you're listening to EJ's quote, but you're only hearing what you want to hear and not asking any questions.

brian said...

Ok. So was EJ playing up top when he scored? That's all I'm trying to argue

Jon said...

What does Dik mean Jozy wouldn't have scored those two goals? Dik, how about you point out to all of us when in his last few appearances he got the service Zusi/Gordon provided EJ? Exactly which cross recently did Jozy flub with a clear SOG? It goes back to service. Jozy hasn't gotten any service when out there for us.

I'd also wager Jozy puts away the two opportunities Gomez flubbed. Those through balls where you're 1v1 with the keeper are exactly the type Jozy regularly puts away with AZ. Yet Gomez's donkey touch f'ed those opportunities up. Glad he works hard though, lol. Most time the less talented have to work hard just to get on the pitch.

Anyway, it can be easily argued both EJ and Gomez were recipients of service last night, two opportunities each, that Jozy hasn't received in almost a year. There aren't any blown opportunities recently for Jozy, as the service hasn't been there.

The Streetsweeper said...

Hang on.

What part of us having 7 players in the attacking third on a set piece in the 86th minute is fantasy?

What part of the mathematical dangers of a USA loss, as opposed to a draw, vs. A&B is fantasy?

What part of their being a historical precedent for giving up counter attack goals vs A&B is fantasy?

What part of needing to stay numbers up in the back to preserve a draw on the road in crap conditions is fantasy?

Was EJ playing up top? Sure.

Was my bellyaching about meaningless friendly wins vs. Italy and Mexico besides the point? Perhaps.

It doesn't change the fact that we have a coach who talks down to his team, the media who covers it, and the fans who support it.

I spent over 10 years making my living trying to grow soccer in this country at both the MLS, USL and club levels. It chaps my ass that this self-important snake oil salesman is jeopardizing the future of the game in this country.


The Streetsweeper said...

And no, D, 10 points does not jeopardize our future. It's the degree to which he needlessly, seemingly heedlessly, put those ten points in jeopardy that I speak of.

dikranovich said...

streeper, with guatemala winning, a tie last night for the usa would have been tantamount to a loss.

Greg Seltzer said...

Noooooo, it would have been tantamount to a draw, as in the US would have still finished a point ahead of Guatemala by beating them in KC, as opposed to losing to A&B before a win over Guatemala would leave us level on points.

Where do you get this stuff?

dikranovich said...

greg, you are entering fantasy land again. the usa won last night, and that was a big win. no, it was a huge win. a huge three points.

everything else is puff. speaking of......

Greg Seltzer said...

Nobody said it wasn't a big win. But it was, in every conceivable way, mathematical and not, the difference between a win and a draw - not a win and a tantamount-ed loss.

Had Antigua beaten us, THAT would have been like a loss. Ya know... because it would be a loss.

dikranovich said...

greg, please dont be like this. ok? please....

dikranovich said...

people, did we ever go over the monty hall exercise? maybe it would help.

dikranovich said...

ok, so you are on monty hall and he gives you three options. two doors contain a goose egg, nada, nothing, but one door has the golden ball. first thing monty does is ask you to choose a door, and after you do he says he is going to show you a loser door, one with a goose egg, of the two remaining doors.

after he shows you a loser door, leaving the door you picked and one other door, he asks if you want to stay with your original pick, or switch to the last door. what should you do?

Save the empire said...

I've never posted here before but just to clarify quotes from klinsmen post game " In that moment, we switched over to a diamond and then there was a clear No. 6 in Jermaine (Jones) and we told Michael to come from half left and push more forward.

Greg Seltzer said...

That quote is referring to the Williams/Jones sub. And however you slice it, Johnson still appeared wide left and Bradley never did. Perhaps he meant on a central line with Dempsey, who shaded right.

Save the empire said...

And also "Bringing in Alan Gordon, you switch over to two forwards that have to be present in the box and switch Clint (Dempsey) back to a No. 10, changing the formation to a diamond because you’ve got to do something different if you’re not getting through.

Save the empire said...

I think you are both right in a way. Clearly it didn't change until the Gordon sub although the klinsman quite I posted indicates he felt he did it earlier. I think they did push EJ up front and played the diamond without a left winger and just had Bradley shaded left but never out running the touchljne

The Streetsweeper said...

Okay Dikran,

It seems you have something of a reputation here, and if that involves tweaking the dude who runs this blog so be it.

However. Some say you are unreasonable for the sake of sport and therefore it is pointless to engage you in debate. Let's try this and see how it goes:

USA ties A&B
Guatemala wins by 1

Guatemala 10 points +3GD
USA 8 points +2
Jamaica 7 points +0

Okay, now, you see how in that scenario, if we beat Guatemala, by any score, we advance? Even if Jamaica beats A&B by five in the final game? Do you see how we are in no way susceptible to missing the hex due to goal differential?

Do you recall how I laid out the math pretty clearly that had we lost we would have been susceptible to missing the hex due to goal differential?

Before I write anything else, are you willing, dikranovich, to concede that a tie would not have been tantamount to a loss?

dikranovich, please don't be like this. ok? please...

red61 said...

@dikranovich-you live in your moms basement?

dikranovich said...

dude, the only way the usa can not qualify for the next round is if they get beat on goal differential. isnt that the reality of this situation? a tie was not tantamount to a loss, but only if guatemala/jamaica ended in a tie also, or jamaica won, but neither of those things is what happened, guatemala won.

dikranovich said...

oh, and sweeper, if a and b ties jamaica in their final game, according to your senario, usa could still miss out, if they lost to guatemala, by more than two goals. so infact, there is a way usa could miss out on goal differential. according to your fantasy.

The Streetsweeper said...

Okay,

My new theory is that Seltzer IS dikranovich, and he is doing this to increase traffic and post numbers.

WELL PLAYED, SELTZER!

Love the site.

Since I can't imagine Dempsey not playing Klinsmann's idea of a withdrawn striker I will not bother hoping for Dempsey at LM.

Here is what I'm hoping for:

---Johnson---Dempsey---
Kljestan-------------Zusi
----Bradley----Williams--
Johnson-Boca-Cam'ron-Dolo

Greg Seltzer said...

Absolutely not. Stuff like that drives me insane. I am me and only me, at all times.

dikranovich said...

no, no, no, and no. but streetsweeper, that is a nice lineup. but tell us what to do if fabian johnson cant go on tuesday night?

dikranovich said...

its so boring in my basement, when there is no soccer being played on a sunday morning. i think ill go into the garden and watch my ligularia palmatiloba come into bloom.

The Streetsweeper said...

I kid, Seltzer.

Some men you just can't reach.

I am curious if the Dutch media had anything to say about Altidore not getting called up?

Greg Seltzer said...

The ones I saw were confused by it.

paul said...

Huh... I now have more respect for EJ, his instincts are sharp...

Watch the replay of the first goal buildup. Watch it over and over, looking at the various players' reactions the instant the cross is sent. EJ's instincts are more aggressive than every single other player; both folks forward for our team, and their defense. His anticipation was on point, "that shit is mine", right from when the ball was let loose.

We need that.
(Second goal was similar too.)

dikranovich said...

coach klinsmann is a gunslinger and maybe he will try and pump guatemala full of goals. 3-5-2

cameron boca edu.

williams bradley

Will Parchman said...

Looks like I missed a party.

dikranovich said...

felix baumgartner broke the sound barrier today and yet it was not the performance of the day. that title belongs to one Robert Griffin III. the essence.

Greg Seltzer said...

Pfffffft. Cardinals bullpen, over and out.